Monday, January 14, 2008
Simple Counter-Evangelism 101
Saturday, January 05, 2008
Advance in what?
Maybe it’s just human nature for believers to claim that their so-called holy books are advance. That’s natural and I can live with that. I really don’t care if you are just defending your religious belief; well it’s just belief anyway. The problem is when they claim that certain facts prove that...Hmmmmm, I think you get the picture.
Here’s an example. Eliseo (you know him?) wrote this article to prove that the Bible is an advance book. According to him, “The Bible is the one and only book on earth that carries with it an authority and authentication not coming from any human person, but from somebody whose knowledge is above nature and humans. This person is God. I will ask you some questions and try to answer them carefully and honestly.”
And so he answered it...but I doubt if it’s carefully and honestly.
Claim No.1 Advance in astronomy and earth science.
This belief that the earth is flat was shared even by powerful people up to the middle ages. It was only very recently that we have had physical evidences showing the picture of the earth caught from outer space by the cameras of the series of Apollo spaceships that were sent to the moon that proves that the earth is round and spherical in shape. This truth is already revealed in the Bible, less than 3000 years before it was seen by man. In the book of Isaiah 40:22 it says…
“It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in…”
And again…
(Amos 9:6) “The One who builds His upper chambers in the heavens And has founded His vaulted dome over the earth, He who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the face of the earth, The LORD is His name.” (NASB)
These informations are present in the Bible long before man has seen physical evidences with his eyes that the earth is round. This truth can not come from any human source, but from Somebody dictating to prophet Isaiah what to write. Just like the prophet Daniel, Isaiah may not know or have any idea of the physical reality of the truth he is writing, but it was written for us to realize that wisdom in the Bible came from a Supernatural Being.
This belief that the earth is flat was shared even by powerful people up to the middle ages. It was only very recently that we have had physical evidences showing the picture of the earth caught from outer space by the cameras of the series of Apollo spaceships that were sent to the moon that proves that the earth is round and spherical in shape. This truth is already revealed in the Bible, less than 3000 years before it was seen by man.
The problem of this claim: In discussing the spherical era of Earth's history, the Encyclopedia Britannica (Vol. 6, 1978, pp. 1-3) explains that ancient astronomers determined that the earth was round by observing its circular shadow move across the moon during lunar eclipses. The Egyptians and Greeks as far back as 2550 BCE (more than a thousand years before Moses) knew not only the earth's spherical shape but also its approximate size. The Grecian philosopher Pythagoras, who was born in 532 BCE, defended the spherical theory on the basis of observations he had made of the shape of the sun and moon. If this information was generally known by educated Greeks and Egyptians before and during biblical times, how can anyone say with certitude that the writers of the Book of Isaiah couldn't have known about it?
So Eliseo’s claim is imaginary. Humans already know that before the Bible mentioned it on its pages.
Also, let’s take a good look at Isaiah 40:22. According to Eliseo, the word “the circle of the earth” confirms the scientific foreknowledge of the Bible and...What? Wait a minute...I thought he’ll answer this carefully and honestly?
Let’s look at Isaiah 40:22
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
Have you noticed that this verse compared “the circle of the earth” to a tent and not a ball? Maybe you’re familiar with a tent. Isn't it nice to know that the heavens are spread out like a tent? All the tents I have seen were domed over a flat surface. In Hebrew, the word used for “circle” is “khug”, and just think for once, a plate is also a circle, a coin is also a circle, yet they are not spheres.
I would like to thank Eliseo’s own article from providing us more information. This piece of article can be found on his own post...and according to him, it came from Reader’s Digest Library of Modern Knowledge book 1 p.14 which says, “The Mediterranean and Middle Eastern people of the first millennium B.C. pictured the Earth as a flat slab of land, which was rectangular or circular in shape and rimmed by sea, and which at some point met the sky. What happened on this horizon no one knew; the fear of reaching the edge of the world discouraged mariners from sailing far from coasts they knew.”
The article speaks about the Mediterranean and Middle Eastern people of the first millennium B.C. That includes the ancient Hebrews. According to Isaiah 40:22 the Earth is like a dome where God sit upon it. The Hebrews copied this “cosmology” from more ancient Mediterranean and Middle Eastern civilization like Sumeria.
When the authors of Isaiah attempted to talk about Earth Science, their only source of knowledge was a chain of written history dating back to the Sumerian Civilization. The Sumerians were the first to invent writing—cuneiform—approximately 4000 BC or shortly thereafter.
The verse from Amos validated my claim.
(Amos 9:6) “The One who builds His upper chambers in the heavens And has founded His vaulted dome over the earth, He who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the face of the earth, The LORD is His name.”
Notice the word “vaulted dome”?
Claim No. 2 That the Bible has already prophesized that human knowledge will increase.
(Daniel 12:8-10, 4) “And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand…
“…But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
The prophet Daniel wrote these passages, but do not have the slightest idea of what a cell phone, a television, or a computer would look like when the fulfillment of the words “Many shall run to and fro and knowledge shall be increased…” come into reality. This further proves that there was Someone who has the capacity to see what will happen in the future, dictated Daniel what to write in his book of the Bible. There is no possibility whatsoever that these advance information, which the Bible calls ‘prophecies’, can come from human mind, but from Someone far more superior in humans in understanding and wisdom.
The Bible is the only book on earth that tells us things that will happen before they happen, many centuries ahead.
The problem of this claim: I really don’t get this one. It seems that Eliseo is implying that in the time of the ancients, there were no increased of knowledge, that the world was filled with primitives, heathens, savages, dummies. Their intelligence matched their simple technologies; their languages were simple, their cultures were primitive, they were brutes. So do other ancient culture’s heads empty? It looks as if the idea that someday knowledge will increase were not dreamed by other culture.
To say that only the Bible has prophesied the increased of knowledge in the future is badly flawed. More ancient religions and sacred writing have already done that even before the Hebrews walk out of Egypt. Whether it is bad or good other ancient cultures have predicted the boosted of knowledge. Here are some examples:
The Hindu epic poem, Mahabharata, written between 300 BCE and 300 CE described what appears to be nuclear and also describe the effects of radioactive poisoning.
It states: "… a single projectile charged with all the power of the universe. An incandescent column of smoke and fire, as brilliant as ten thousand suns, rose in all its splendor. It was the unknown weapon, the iron thunderbolt, a gigantic messenger of death which reduced to ashes the entire race of Vrishnis and Andhakas.
The corpses were so burnt they were no longer recognizable. Hair and nails fell out. Pottery broke without cause... Foodstuffs were poisoned. To escape, the warriors threw themselves in streams to wash themselves and their equipment.
The poem goes on to describe the devastation of this weapon which is similar to the destruction of the A-bomb. "A substance like fire has sprung into existence…blistering hills. Rivers, and trees. All… are being reduced to ashes."
Here’s an example. Eliseo (you know him?) wrote this article to prove that the Bible is an advance book. According to him, “The Bible is the one and only book on earth that carries with it an authority and authentication not coming from any human person, but from somebody whose knowledge is above nature and humans. This person is God. I will ask you some questions and try to answer them carefully and honestly.”
And so he answered it...but I doubt if it’s carefully and honestly.
Claim No.1 Advance in astronomy and earth science.
This belief that the earth is flat was shared even by powerful people up to the middle ages. It was only very recently that we have had physical evidences showing the picture of the earth caught from outer space by the cameras of the series of Apollo spaceships that were sent to the moon that proves that the earth is round and spherical in shape. This truth is already revealed in the Bible, less than 3000 years before it was seen by man. In the book of Isaiah 40:22 it says…
“It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in…”
And again…
(Amos 9:6) “The One who builds His upper chambers in the heavens And has founded His vaulted dome over the earth, He who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the face of the earth, The LORD is His name.” (NASB)
These informations are present in the Bible long before man has seen physical evidences with his eyes that the earth is round. This truth can not come from any human source, but from Somebody dictating to prophet Isaiah what to write. Just like the prophet Daniel, Isaiah may not know or have any idea of the physical reality of the truth he is writing, but it was written for us to realize that wisdom in the Bible came from a Supernatural Being.
This belief that the earth is flat was shared even by powerful people up to the middle ages. It was only very recently that we have had physical evidences showing the picture of the earth caught from outer space by the cameras of the series of Apollo spaceships that were sent to the moon that proves that the earth is round and spherical in shape. This truth is already revealed in the Bible, less than 3000 years before it was seen by man.
The problem of this claim: In discussing the spherical era of Earth's history, the Encyclopedia Britannica (Vol. 6, 1978, pp. 1-3) explains that ancient astronomers determined that the earth was round by observing its circular shadow move across the moon during lunar eclipses. The Egyptians and Greeks as far back as 2550 BCE (more than a thousand years before Moses) knew not only the earth's spherical shape but also its approximate size. The Grecian philosopher Pythagoras, who was born in 532 BCE, defended the spherical theory on the basis of observations he had made of the shape of the sun and moon. If this information was generally known by educated Greeks and Egyptians before and during biblical times, how can anyone say with certitude that the writers of the Book of Isaiah couldn't have known about it?
So Eliseo’s claim is imaginary. Humans already know that before the Bible mentioned it on its pages.
Also, let’s take a good look at Isaiah 40:22. According to Eliseo, the word “the circle of the earth” confirms the scientific foreknowledge of the Bible and...What? Wait a minute...I thought he’ll answer this carefully and honestly?
Let’s look at Isaiah 40:22
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:
Have you noticed that this verse compared “the circle of the earth” to a tent and not a ball? Maybe you’re familiar with a tent. Isn't it nice to know that the heavens are spread out like a tent? All the tents I have seen were domed over a flat surface. In Hebrew, the word used for “circle” is “khug”, and just think for once, a plate is also a circle, a coin is also a circle, yet they are not spheres.
I would like to thank Eliseo’s own article from providing us more information. This piece of article can be found on his own post...and according to him, it came from Reader’s Digest Library of Modern Knowledge book 1 p.14 which says, “The Mediterranean and Middle Eastern people of the first millennium B.C. pictured the Earth as a flat slab of land, which was rectangular or circular in shape and rimmed by sea, and which at some point met the sky. What happened on this horizon no one knew; the fear of reaching the edge of the world discouraged mariners from sailing far from coasts they knew.”
The article speaks about the Mediterranean and Middle Eastern people of the first millennium B.C. That includes the ancient Hebrews. According to Isaiah 40:22 the Earth is like a dome where God sit upon it. The Hebrews copied this “cosmology” from more ancient Mediterranean and Middle Eastern civilization like Sumeria.
When the authors of Isaiah attempted to talk about Earth Science, their only source of knowledge was a chain of written history dating back to the Sumerian Civilization. The Sumerians were the first to invent writing—cuneiform—approximately 4000 BC or shortly thereafter.
The verse from Amos validated my claim.
(Amos 9:6) “The One who builds His upper chambers in the heavens And has founded His vaulted dome over the earth, He who calls for the waters of the sea And pours them out on the face of the earth, The LORD is His name.”
Notice the word “vaulted dome”?
Claim No. 2 That the Bible has already prophesized that human knowledge will increase.
(Daniel 12:8-10, 4) “And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand…
“…But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.”
The prophet Daniel wrote these passages, but do not have the slightest idea of what a cell phone, a television, or a computer would look like when the fulfillment of the words “Many shall run to and fro and knowledge shall be increased…” come into reality. This further proves that there was Someone who has the capacity to see what will happen in the future, dictated Daniel what to write in his book of the Bible. There is no possibility whatsoever that these advance information, which the Bible calls ‘prophecies’, can come from human mind, but from Someone far more superior in humans in understanding and wisdom.
The Bible is the only book on earth that tells us things that will happen before they happen, many centuries ahead.
The problem of this claim: I really don’t get this one. It seems that Eliseo is implying that in the time of the ancients, there were no increased of knowledge, that the world was filled with primitives, heathens, savages, dummies. Their intelligence matched their simple technologies; their languages were simple, their cultures were primitive, they were brutes. So do other ancient culture’s heads empty? It looks as if the idea that someday knowledge will increase were not dreamed by other culture.
To say that only the Bible has prophesied the increased of knowledge in the future is badly flawed. More ancient religions and sacred writing have already done that even before the Hebrews walk out of Egypt. Whether it is bad or good other ancient cultures have predicted the boosted of knowledge. Here are some examples:
The Hindu epic poem, Mahabharata, written between 300 BCE and 300 CE described what appears to be nuclear and also describe the effects of radioactive poisoning.
It states: "… a single projectile charged with all the power of the universe. An incandescent column of smoke and fire, as brilliant as ten thousand suns, rose in all its splendor. It was the unknown weapon, the iron thunderbolt, a gigantic messenger of death which reduced to ashes the entire race of Vrishnis and Andhakas.
The corpses were so burnt they were no longer recognizable. Hair and nails fell out. Pottery broke without cause... Foodstuffs were poisoned. To escape, the warriors threw themselves in streams to wash themselves and their equipment.
The poem goes on to describe the devastation of this weapon which is similar to the destruction of the A-bomb. "A substance like fire has sprung into existence…blistering hills. Rivers, and trees. All… are being reduced to ashes."
Not only the Hindus but also the American Indian Hopi tribe has foreseen that men will invent a thermonuclear device. "The white brother will bring the symbol of the sun which makes a great explosion shaking the earth…
One of the most astounding prophecies of the American Indians, especially by the Hopi and the Aztec, was the coming of the white man, called Pahána, to the New World.
The Hopi said the white men would return with the sign of the cross and bring a holocaust upon the land through his inventions and lack of spirituality. Remember, the American Indians had no knowledge of Christianity.
As the American Indians prophesied, the new inhabitants of the land were great inventors. Ironically, many people from all different cultures prophesied of these new inventions before their times. This is in light of the fact that most people only knew of transportation by horses, asses, and boats.
(Source: Hogue, John The Millennium Book of Prophecy © 1994 Harper-Collins)
Oh and one more thing, the ancients are really not that naive as Eliseo think they are. Have you ever read the works Zechariah Sitchin’s The 12th Planet and Erich von Däniken’s Chariot of the Gods? You will notice that these books promote the advancements of science and technology from ancient culture such as Sumeria, Egypt, Babylonia and Mayan.
In 3100 BCE Menes, the founder of the 1st Dynasty writes The Secret Book of the Heart, describing 3 kinds of healers, the physician, the priest and the sorcerer. He already knew the role of the physician in healing ailments.
The Sumerians have invented the cylinder seal, the forerunner of the modern rotary press, the ziggurat, the kilt among others, all in the time of 3500 BCE.
In the Papyrus Ebers, the Ancient Egyptians were discovering things about how the human body worked and they knew that the heart, pulse rates, blood and air were important to the workings of the human body, "46 vessels go from the heart to every limb, if a doctor places his hand or fingers on the back of the head, hands, stomach, arms or feet then he hears the heart. The heart speaks out of every limb."
The papyrus continues:
"There are 4 vessels to his nostrils, 2 give mucus and 2 give blood; there are 4 vessels in his forehead; there are 6 vessels that lead to the arms; there are 6 vessels that lead to the feet; there are 2 vessels to his testicles (and) it is they which give semen; there are 2 vessels to the buttocks."
The document actually gives names to organs such as the spleen, the heart, the anus, the lungs etc so they must have known that these exist. One papyrus, the Edwin Smith Papyrus, has a detailed description of the brain in it so this organ was also well researched by the standards of the time. It is probable that this knowledge came as a result of the practice the Ancient Egyptians had of embalming dead bodies.
Claim No. 3 That only the Bible told us that it is good to cry and laughter is the best medicine.
Not only science, but also medical knowledge that man have learned very lately, and history, can attest to the authenticity of this one and only book.
The Bible tells us that it is good to cry.
(Ecclesiastes 7:2) “It is better to go to the house of mourning, than to go to the house of feasting: for that is the end of all men; and the living will lay it to his heart.”
(James 4:9) “Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness.”
Medical findings have proven that what the Bible says is true.
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/health_medical/article24374 69.ece
Equally true is: We must not indulge in too much weariness and crying.
(1 Corinthians 7: 29-30) “But this I say, brethren, the time is short: it remaineth, that both they that have wives be as though they had none; And they that weep, as though they wept not; and they that rejoice, as though they rejoiced not; and they that buy, as though they possessed not…”
This will mean that we have to laugh also and be merry.
(Proverbs 17:22) “A merry heart doeth good like a medicine: but a broken spirit drieth the bones.”
There is no contradiction in the preceding verses that I have cited. We have to laugh. We have to cry. It depends upon the situation. It is natural. It is healthy. So, the Bible speaks the truth! Why the Bible? Think it over and over again.
The problem of this claim: Throughout history, spiritual traditions in China, Japan and India have revered the sacred strength of laughter. Lao-Tzu is always pictured smiling. Samurai are always laughing. “Laughter Yoga” was a practice of the ancient rishis of India over 5,000 years ago.
Hypocrites, in his medical treatise, stressed the importance of “a gay and cheerful mood on the part of the physician and patient fighting disease”.
In the Native American culture for example, “Nanabush” the trickster, a central figure in Chippewa (Ojibwa) storytelling, challenges the gods and cheats death by playing a trick on them: “During the year of the sickness, when I was the last one left, I saved myself by starting a story. Death could not get a word in edgewise, grew discouraged, and traveled on”. Nanapush demonstrates the power of Native American humor against sickness and death.
The ancient Hawaiians assert there are two chemical reactions within the human body that can accomplish Reconnection with Source Oneness. The first is the "sacred tear” beneath our sadness and hopelessness. Beneath that tear lies the second chemical reaction, said to be more powerful than all the healing agents known to humankind. It comes "out of the blue" with the power of a jackhammer, shattering the seriousness of the entire human estate. A power instantly freeing and balancing to all the body's chemistry. This is the power of laughter. When it comes in this manner, it comes through the "na'au" (gut level) and will pierce the hopelessness of any situation or attitude. It is not a power to be taken lightly, for the ancient Hawaiians say it holds the chemistry of immortality and will instantly heal any terminal disease. It’s said to be the "laughter of God" which shatters the ridiculousness of hopelessness.
Claim No. 4 Historical claims
History and archeology also proves the authenticity of the Bible. Findings in archeology have proven so many times that what is recorded in the Bible are actual facts and truth. Roman coins found in Samaria authenticates the records in Matthew 22:17-21.
“And he saith unto them, Whose is this image and superscription? They say unto him, Caesar’s. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s; and unto God the things that are God’s.”
The discovery of the tunnel built by King Hezekiah authenticates the passages written in the book of Kings.
(2 Kings 20:20) “And the rest of the acts of Hezekiah, and all his might, and how he made a pool, and a conduit, and brought water into the city, are they not written in the book of the chronicles of the kings of Judah?
The discovery of a limestone with the inscription that bares the name of Pontius Pilate is another proof of the Bible’s authenticity.
(John 19:6) “When the chief priests therefore and officers saw him, they cried out, saying, Crucify him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Take ye him, and crucify him: for I find no fault in him.”?
The problem of this claim: The claim is really non-sequitur. Eliseo is making a conclusion that since these structures and personality exists, that means the Bible history is authentic. Have you heard of a historical fiction? While there are some historical facts in the Bible, it represents a gross misrepresentation of the current state of archaeology to say that it has “never” contradicted the Bible. For example, archaeological research has demonstrated that the city of Ai, reported in Josh. 8 to have been conquered by Joshua, was a heap of ruins centuries before Joshua's time as discovered by Kathleen Kenyon.
Bear in mind that the Bible, as we know it today, is the end product of a long process of writing, editing and selecting of literature primarily concerned with the saga explaining how the nation Israel came to be, the development of the Jewish religious concepts, and its long literary history. It cannot be assumed that a group of men composed writings echoing what they thought God was dictating. The Bible reflects historical situations, human events, men's reactions to these happenings, and the belief that God was also involved in events.
The problem here is how you can distinguish history from legend. Sure England exists, but can you prove that King Arthur also exists. Montalban, Rizal and Mount Makiling are real places, but are Bernardo Carpio and Mariang Makiling also real people?
The story of Jose Rizal is a good example. If you’re familiar with your Rizaliana, you may find the story of Rizal throwing his slippers in Pasig, River as a legend, yet the whole Rizal story is factual and supported by documents. How about the story that George Washington chopped a cherry tree? Do you think historians already know that George Washington will become the first president of the United State of America and were already ready to record his biography when he was still a toddler?
One characteristic that helps to distinguish legend from history is the tendency of those who record legend to use terms to indicate the great age of the account without being specific as to when, precisely, the event occurred just like the samples above.
Another distinguishing feature lies in the tendency of historical writings to deal with matters of public importance, events that affect the political and public welfare of the group. In legend, the account centers on a person who may embody or dramatize the spirit of the group for whom the tale is recounted.
Example, although much of I and II Kings are historical, The dates of composition of these books are unknown, but although there are variants as to the actual number of editions the books went through, the consensus is that the language and outlook seems to point to a post exilic period (after 586 BCE) of composition. Saying that these books may contain some historical facts should in no way be confused with the claim that these books are accurate, or true, in all aspects. The same explanation can also be used in Matthew 22:17-21. If Pontius Pilate is an existing “Perfect of Judea" (not a “procurator” as Eliseo and Tacitus believed) in the suppose time of Jesus, the events narrated in Matthew 27:51-53 is too far-fetched to be considered as a historical event.
Remember, archaeological contributions provide no definite clues for determining whether or not the Bible is completely authentic and accurate in all its claims.
Claim No. 5 Tacitus
The same account was mentioned in the history of the Roman Empire (Annals 15:44)
The Roman historian Tacitus wrote concerning the Great Fire of Rome, in book 15, chapter 44 of his Annals (c. 116): Auctor nominis eius Christus Tibero imperitante per procuratorem Pontium Pilatum supplicio adfectus erat…
Translated in English as:
Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius:
The problem with this claim:
The Roman historian Cornelius Tacitus, occasionally reported stories which were false historically but were true in a literary sense or a moral sense. (E.P. Sanders, The Historical Figure of Jesus (New York: Penguin, 1993) (Tacitus: The Annals of Imperial Rome (Penguin Books, 1973)
Also bear in mind that the historian Tacitus did not live during the purported time of Jesus but was born two decades after Jesus alleged death; thus, if there were any passages in his work referring to Christ or his immediate followers, they would be hand-me-down stories.
Even in the book of Jewish antiquities, we can find this account:
About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Messiah. And when, upon the accusation of the principal men among us, Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had first come to love him did not cease. He appeared to them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had foretold these things and a thousand other marvels about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared.
- Jewish Antiquities, 18.3.3 §63 written by Flavius Josephus
The problem of this claim:
1. It is unlikely that Josephus, a Jew, would have called Jesus the Messiah.
2. The passage is never quoted by Justin Martyr, Clement of Alexandria, Tertullian, or Origen, despite its enormous apologetic value.
3. From the fact that Josephus needed to distinguish this Jesus from other people in his book named Jesus, it does not follow that the phrase "called the Christ" was the most likely way Josephus could have identified Jesus. Josephus could have also said, "the one who was crucified by Pilate," since Josephus' earlier reference to Jesus did mention that point.
4. It is unlikely that Josephus would have written the other italicized phrases; Most scholars suspect there has been at least some tampering with the text on the basis of some or all of the italicized sections. Thus scholarly opinion can be divided into three camps: those who accept the entire passage as authentic; those who reject the entire passage as a Christian interpolation into the text (perhaps authored by the fourth-century church historian Eusebius); and those who believe that the original text contained an authentic reference to Jesus but was later embellished by Christian copyists.
That’s the problem with claims. Most people seem to shy off from other explanations just to defend their contentions. If you would like to respond questions, - questions like why we should believe in the BIBLE, - well carefully and honestly is not enough. You should answer it free from biases and historically accurate as possible.
Until next time,
John the Atheist
Sunday, December 02, 2007
Jesus Jokes
Thursday, November 29, 2007
The Bible is scientific...Tell that to the Marines!
I really don’t know about these Bible idolaters. They disrepute science yet they are always trying hard to make the Bible look scientific. Take this case of this Christian cult leader who has this reputation of cussing people who seems to disagree to his outrageous claims.
Yep I’m talking about Eliseo Soriano, leader of this tele-Christian variety show, “Ang Dating Daan”. He’s not even through on lambasting other Christian sects and now he’s aiming his sight against a reputable person named Mr. Marshall Brain. Boy! Talk about being “asar-talo”.
According to this self-conceited jester...Mr. Brain’s allegation that the Bible is full of anti-scientific nonsense is completely baseless and stupid.
Yep I’m talking about Eliseo Soriano, leader of this tele-Christian variety show, “Ang Dating Daan”. He’s not even through on lambasting other Christian sects and now he’s aiming his sight against a reputable person named Mr. Marshall Brain. Boy! Talk about being “asar-talo”.
According to this self-conceited jester...Mr. Brain’s allegation that the Bible is full of anti-scientific nonsense is completely baseless and stupid.
Well what is the difference between Mr. Brain and Eliseo anyway? Mr. Brain has a website. Yep a website that teaches science. It’s called How Stuffs Works. It’s a good site that teaches science and technology, especially to curious kids and unlike Eliseo Soriano who keeps on praying to God just to appear to the Oprah Winfrey Show, Mr. Brain already appeared on that show on Jan 19, 2006.
Mr. Brain is also an author and had written more than a dozen books. His notable achievement is being selected for the New York Public Library's prestigious Books for the Teen Age list. He’s also known as a member of the Academy of Outstanding Teachers at North Carolina State University, where he taught in the computer science department for 6 years. He also appeared in some shows in CNN, National Geographics and Fox Network.
On the other hand, Eliseo Soriano boasts that he has the most visited internet site (in the Philippines?) (Well...I know that Google is the most visited site in the Internet. According to comScore, the number one most visited site is Yahoo.), that he has the a fast growing church in the Philippines and that he knows the Bible compare to all other Christians in the face of this planet...He once had a TV show titled “Ang Dating Daan” (The Old Path). Thanks to the INC (Iglesia Ni Christo), the show was cut-off the air and was transferred to a new channel (Unfortunately this UHF channel is too remote and ridden with static.) I also heard that Eliseo is famous for insulting the Muslims.
Eliseo Soriano is best known for criticizing various denominations through his program "Ang Dating Daan" for their doctrines, practices and what he says are false teachings including the Catholic Church, Pentecostal Demoninations, Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh-day Adventist Church, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Iglesia ni Cristo, another Philippine-based religion which he calls Iglesia ni Manalo (Church of Manalo). He also claims that he had this God-given knowledge to interpret the Bible. Hmmmm...Maybe that’s why he got pissed off when he read Mr. Brain’s comment on his beloved Bible. Naturally, the Bible is Eliseo’s tool of the trade.
So let see...Is Mr. Brain’s comment correct?
According to Eliseo because no human intelligence can fathom the deep things of God, there are those like Marshall Brain that pervert or wrestle the word of God. He also said even the knowledge and understanding of the mysteries in the Bible is not attainable by
human efforts but, is given by God.
Really Eliseo?
Gas-gas nay-an Eliseo!
How inspired is this so-called holy book? Is inspiration included when your god orders his favorite pets to kill innocent women and babies? Do you need a “heavenly understanding” to comprehend a god who allows his puppets to rape and plunder?
Boy! If that is what you think of Godly inspirations, then its better not to be inspired by such hideous monster! Now look at Siddhartha. He is not divinely inspired by Eliseo’s Bible, but clearly he promotes the use of common-sense.
Ok I cannot fathom God...When Jesus was hungry, instead of promoting the propagation of figs even when it’s not fig season, he curses the poor tree to die. Sounds nauseating! I think Bathalla, Punhuldayan, Kabunyan and Mele can do a better job.
There is nothing to fathom here Eliseo. Clearly the book was written by primitive culture that hasn’t had any slight idea on the technology of proper irrigation and farming!
Oh and there are also stories of how Jesus cure lepers huh? Very touching...Yet did he ever accomplished of polishing off that damn disease out of this planet? We have to wait for his second coming for that? Then what the hell did he do in his first coming?
Mr. Brain doesn’t need to pervert the Bible. It’s already perverted.
If the Bible was not divinely inspired, how can primitive people write scientific facts long before they were understood by modern science?
Scientific Facts or “scientific farts”?
(Psalms 102:25-26) “Of old hast thou laid the foundation of the earth: and
the heavens are the work of thy hands. They shall perish, but thou shalt endure:
yea, all of them shall wax old like a garment; as a vesture shalt thou change
them, and they shall be changed…”
According to Eliseo, this verse is talking about how the stars dying out. He even says that black holes are proof of this. But the verse is not about the death of stars.
Eliseo concluded that the presence of black holes in the vast space of the universe which, according to science, are remains of a star that collapsed, proves the scientific precision of what was written by David about 3,000 years ago. Yet the verse said heavens...not stars. If we look at the verse, heaven here speak of all celestial bodies...including black holes. (Strange that heaven here is in plural form – Does that include all of the 7 heavens?) So will the whole universe perish, as David and Eliseo think? If the heavens are made up of “matter and energy” and matter and energy is not created nor can be destroyed, then I think Eliseo and David must again brush up with their Physics 101. Clearly Eliseo is just twisting the scriptures to serve his own ends. Oh and before I forget, the heaven is really one very big...Black Hole and Bible twisting experts are really...ass holes.
(Job 26:7) “He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the
earth upon nothing.”
In this verse, Eliseo justify that the scientific fact that the earth is hanging on an empty space in the universe is divine information and a scientific truth that was written by a ‘primitive’ man many thousands of years ago.
Really?
So may I ask, where is “north” in empty space? There is no "empty place" in our northern space. Everywhere astronomers look; they find space filled with galaxies and stars. That includes our northern space too. Another scientific boo-boo eh Eliseo?
(Genesis 2:16) “And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of
the garden thou mayest freely eat…”
Eliseo thinks that this verse talks about man being a frugivore, which proves another scientific fact. (Eliseo: The recent findings of modern scientists, that human beings are not to be considered herbivore or omnivore, but frugivore, proves another scientific fact written by Moses in the book of Genesis many millennia ago. )
Maybe he never truly understood archaic English...Let’s see what this verse says in modern English.
16 And the Lord God gave the man orders, saying, You may freely take of the
fruit of every tree of the garden:
So that’s clear enough for you? God says that man can take any (remember! “any”) fruit in every tree in the garden. It was specified that we are talking about fruits and trees inside the Garden of Eden. We are not talking about man being carnivore, omnivore or what ever “vore” Eliseo would like to imply. Oh and by the way @ Eliseo, apes also eat fruits , so does fruit bats. The Chimpanzee’s teeth for example is build the same as humans to munch fruits. If you believe that only humans are capable of eating fruits, you’re a fruit cake! A frugivore is an animal, such as a chimpanzee or fruit bat, that feeds primarily on fruit, that includes humans as well. So maybe Cain is right when he offered vegetable matters to God...but if the Bible is right, why did Jacob asked for a venison if God knows man should not eat meat?
If we will take Eliseo’s word that the verse is talking about how human eat plants, well that makes us capable of eating “any” plant materials in planet Earth! Well...maybe Eliseo can demonstrate that by eating a good handful of “Tuba-Tuba”.
1 Corinthians 15:39. - “All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind
of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of
birds.”
According to Eliseo, “The apostle Paul has no knowledge at all of the DNA or the genes in any living flesh. When he wrote that human flesh is different from animal flesh, he is writing scientific information that will only be understood by humanity through the science of genealogy.
Genealogy is a new branch of science that studies the genes and the DNA of living organisms. It is wonderful to know that although, physically, there seems to be no difference at all between a human and an animal flesh, but by the study of the DNA in humans and that of animals, science was able to determine the exact difference of the two — proving that the Bible is a no-nonsense and is not an anti-scientific book.”
Hold your horses there Eliseo! First genealogy is not a new branch of science that studies the gene and the DNA (deoxyribonucleic acid) of living organism. My papaya naman! If Eliseo can’t even give a correct meaning of the word “genealogy”, how on Earth can I consider his so-called “scientific proof of the Bible” as accurate? According to Mr. Webster genealogy is:
1. A record or table of the descent of a person, family, or group from an ancestor or ancestors; a family tree.
2. Direct descent from an ancestor; lineage or pedigree.
3. The study or investigation of ancestry and family histories.
Genetics is the branch of biology that deals with heredity, especially the mechanisms of hereditary transmission and the variation of inherited characteristics among similar or related organisms. If we’re going to talk about DNA, I think it will fall more into genetics than genealogy.
DNA is also not about animal flesh. Even your bones have DNA. If you are made up of cells, you got DNA moron!
Eliseo also said: The recent study of human DNA can trace where on earth civilization has started. The fact discovered by DNA scientists has established the trail from where global population originated: and it points to where, according to the Bible, Adam and Eve first lived.
Sorry to burst Eliseo’s ridiculous blabber.
The discovery of the “genetic Eve” base on the female mitochondrial DNA has established the link to Africa. Not in the Middle East. Remember that the Biblical definition of Eden place the site near the land between the Tigris and Euphrates part of what is now known as Iraq.
1 Corinthians 15:39 is used by Creationists to argue against both evolution and any attempt to create "human-animal hybrids" or "chimeras." So that means Bible believers think that this verse justify the “uniqueness” of humans to other animals. It’s not about DNA because every living organism in this planet has a DNA. Also, the verse on its continuity talks about the ability of humans to resurrect from the dead. Paul is not talking about DNA, he’s talking about resurrection of the dead, which is quite unscientific.
38 But God gives it a body, as it is pleasing to him, and to every seed its
special body. 39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one flesh of men,
another of beasts, another of birds, and another of fishes. 40 And there are
bodies of heaven and bodies of earth, but the glory of the one is different from
that of the other. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the
moon, and another glory of the stars; for the glory of one star is different
from that of another. 42 So is it with the coming back from the dead. It is
planted in death; it comes again in life: 43 It is planted in shame; it comes
again in glory: feeble when it is planted, it comes again in power: 44 It is
planted a natural body; it comes again as a body of the spirit. If there is a
natural body, there is equally a body of the spirit. (1 Corinthians 15:
39-44)
Paul is not writing something scientific, he’s writing gibberish esoteric non-sense! Stupid!
So when you are trying to interpret the Bible, please interpret it on how the author wrote it not on how you will like it to become.
Eliseo’s jabbers are clear paradigms of how any dishonest Christian apologetic, sweet-talkers can twist biblical interpretations or hermeneutics to suit his own understanding of science. Unfortunately, there are many gullible people out there who easily fall to this kind of deception. But luckily, there are still people with “brains” who can distinguish real science from biblical illusions and false data, just like Mr. Marshall Brain.
When you try to twist the Bible base on your own schema, it clearly shows that the Bible is really not a scientific book and it also shows that these Bible idolaters are not even sure of what they put their faith on. This is a strong evidence of intellectual dishonesty. Trying to justify the Bible with science clearly show that Eliseo doesn’t trust his own faith...his own God.
So if Eliseo Soriano himself can’t trust the Bible, then why should I trust this stupid book? Clearly the Bible was really written by primitive, superstitious minds.
Until next...same Bat time...Same Bat channel!
John the Atheist.
Thursday, November 22, 2007
Putting it in its proper place
Thursday, November 15, 2007
Infallible?
Every believer considers his holy books as infallible. Naturally, how can you believe it as god given if there are slip-ups written on its page?
Christians believe that the Bible is infallible. According to Norman Giesler, the Bible teaches truth both in spiritual and scientific/historical matters (see: When Skeptics Asked – pp.150-152 Giesler and Brooks). In the Lausanne Covenant of 1974, a statement of faith agreed to by many Evangelical Christian groups from over 150 nation said in Section 2 of “The Authority and Power Of the Bible” It state in part: “We affirm the divine inspiration, truthfulness and authority of both Old and New Testament Scriptures in their entirety as the only written word of God, without error in all that it affirms, and the only infallible rule of faith and practice.”
Christians believe that the Bible is infallible. According to Norman Giesler, the Bible teaches truth both in spiritual and scientific/historical matters (see: When Skeptics Asked – pp.150-152 Giesler and Brooks). In the Lausanne Covenant of 1974, a statement of faith agreed to by many Evangelical Christian groups from over 150 nation said in Section 2 of “The Authority and Power Of the Bible” It state in part: “We affirm the divine inspiration, truthfulness and authority of both Old and New Testament Scriptures in their entirety as the only written word of God, without error in all that it affirms, and the only infallible rule of faith and practice.”
Bible scholar Wayne Grudem defines biblical inerrancy in the following way: "The inerrancy of Scripture means that Scripture in the original manuscripts does not affirm anything that is contrary to fact." He also added that in all his years of studying the Bible, he does not know of any biblical problem passage for which there is not a satisfactory explanation.
Yet not all Christians agree with the unlimited inerrancy of the Bible. The Roman Catholic for instance believe in a limited inerrancy. According to the Second Vatican Council, DOGMATIC CONSTITUTION
ON DIVINE REVELATION DEI VERBUM CHAPTER III SACRED SCRIPTURE, ITS INSPIRATION AND DIVINE INTERPRETATION
11. Those divinely revealed realities which are contained and presented in Sacred Scripture have been committed to writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. For holy mother Church, relying on the belief of the Apostles (see John 20:31; 2 Tim. 3:16; 2 Peter 1:19-20, 3:15-16), holds that the books of both the Old and New Testaments in their entirety, with all their parts, are sacred and canonical because written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, they have God as their author and have been handed on as such to the Church herself.(1) In composing the sacred books, God chose men and while employed by Him (2) they made use of their powers and abilities, so that with Him acting in them and through them, (3) they, as true authors, consigned to writing everything and only those things which He wanted. (4)
Therefore, since everything asserted by the inspired authors or sacred writers must be held to be asserted by the Holy Spirit, it follows that the books of Scripture must be acknowledged as teaching solidly, faithfully and without error that truth which God wanted put into sacred writings (5) for the sake of salvation. Therefore "all Scripture is divinely inspired and has its use for teaching the truth and refuting error, for reformation of manners and discipline in right living, so that the man who belongs to God may be efficient and equipped for good work of every kind"
1. cf. First Vatican Council, Dogmatic Constitution on the Catholic Faith, Chap.
2 "On Revelation:" Denzinger 1787 (3006); Biblical Commission, Decree of June
18,1915: Denzinger 2180 (3629): EB 420; Holy Office, Epistle of Dec. 22, 1923:
EB 499.
2. cf. Pius XII, encyclical "Divino Afflante Spiritu," Sept. 30,
1943: A.A.S. 35 (1943) p. 314; Enchiridion Bible. (EB) 556.
3. "In" and
"for" man: cf. Heb. 1, and 4, 7; ("in"): 2 Sm. 23,2; Matt.1:22 and various
places; ("for"): First Vatican Council, Schema on Catholic Doctrine, note 9:
Coll. Lac. VII, 522.
4. Leo XIII, encyclical "Providentissimus Deus," Nov.
18, 1893: Denzinger 1952 (3293); EB 125.
5. cf. St. Augustine, "Gen. ad
Litt." 2, 9, 20:PL 34, 270-271; Epistle 82, 3: PL 33, 277: CSEL 34, 2, p. 354.
St. Thomas, "On Truth," Q. 12, A. 2, C.Council of Trent, session IV, Scriptural
Canons: Denzinger 783 (1501). Leo XIII, encyclical "Providentissimus Deus:" EB
121, 124, 126-127. Pius XII, encyclical "Divino Afflante Spiritu:" EB 539.
Fr. R.E.Brown for example, wrote , “In this long journey of thought the concept of inerrancy was not rejected but was seriously modified to fit the evidence of biblical criticism which showed that the Bible was not inerrant in question of science, of history, and even of time-conditioned religious beliefs.” That means the Bible is an inerrant guide in matters of faith and practice. The purpose is to lead men to salvation and those any other subjects are of no importance. That means the authors of the Bible may be wrong in matter of geography, science, astronomy, biology and history.
Ok, ok…suppose we acknowledge this explanation. That connotes that Genesis is just a myth. That the Flood never really happened and that Jesus Christ doesn’t exist. All the stories in the Bible were just created to lead man to believe in a god and to accept the promise of salvation or to have a meaningful life. That those stories about Jesus’ return, hell and heaven, Armageddon and Satan were just created to scare the shit out of you! Maybe that’s why most Christians don’t agree with a limited inerrancy.
So we look at the issues of unlimited inerrancy.
According to Giesler, “if the Bible is the Word of God and God can only speak the truth, then there is no way to avoid the conclusion that the Bible contains no error. Inspiration guarantees inerrancy.” (When Skeptics Ask – p. 151)
So if we are going to use Geisler’s logic, if the Bible has errors then it’s not the word of God.
Let’s take a look on the following verses:
• (a) the bat is a bird (Lev. 11:19, Deut. 14:11, 18);
• (b) Some fowls are four-footed (Lev. 11:20-21);
• (c) Some creeping insects have four legs. (Lev. 11:22-23);
• (d) Hares chew the cud (Lev. 11:6);
• (e) Conies chew the cud (Lev. 11:5);
• (f) Camels don't divide the hoof (Lev. 11:4);
• (g) The earth was formed out of and by means of water (2 Peter 3:5 RSV);
• (h) The earth rest on pillars (1 Sam. 2:8);
• (i) The earth won't be moved (1Chron. 16:30);
• (j) A hare does not divide the hoof (Deut. 14:7);
• (k) The rainbow is not as old as rain and sunshine (Gen. 9:13);
• (l) A mustard seed is the smallest of all seeds and grows into the greatest of all shrubs (Matt. 13:31-32 RSV);
• (m) Turtles have voices (Song of Sol. 2:12);
• (n) The earth has ends or edges (Job 37:3);
• (o) The earth has four corners (Isa. 11:12, Rev. 7:1);
• (p) Some 4-legged animals fly (Lev. 11:21);
• (q) The world's language didn't evolve but appeared suddenly (Gen. 11:6-9; and
• (r) A fetus can understand speech (Luke 1:44).
• (s) According to Leviticus 14:49- 53 to cure leprosy one must kill a bird and do some incantations involving cedar woods, scarlet, and hyssop.
• Donkeys can talk (Numbers 22:21-30)
• Moreover the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun…(Isaiah 30:26). Modern astronomy dictates that the moon only reflects its light from the Sun.
Now how can we defend that these statements are scientifically accurate? Remember, Christian believers boast that the Bible is scientifically correct.
How about these mathematical problems?
• (a) "... and the sons of Zerubbabel; Meshullam, and Hananiah, Jusha-bhesed, five." (1 Chron. 3:19-20). How can there be five sons of Zerubbabel when 7 males and one female are listed?
• (b) "And it had for its inheritance (1)Beer-sheba, (2)Sheba, (3)Moladah, (4)Hazar-shual, (5)Balah, (6)Ezem, (7)Eltolad, (8)Bethul, (9)Hormah, (10)Ziklag, (11)Beth-marcaboth, (12)Hazarsuah, (13)Beth-lebaoth, and (14)Sharuhen- thirteen cities with their villages" (Josh. 19:2-6 RSV). Fourteen cities are listed, not 13. If you say, one of those names is not a city, well…where’s your reference?
• (c) "The cities belonging to the tribe of the people of Judah in the extreme South, toward the boundary of Edom, were Kabzeel, Eder, Jagur, Kinah, Dimonah, Adadah, Kedesh, Hazor, Ithnan, Ziph, Telem, Bealoth, Hazor-hadattah, Kerioth-hezron (that is Hazor). Amam,Shema, Moladah, Hazar-gaddah, Heshmon, Bethpelet, Hazar-shual, Beer-sheba, Biziothiah, Baalah, Iim, Ezem, Eltolad, Chesil, Hormah, Ziklag, Madmannah, Sansannah, Lebaoth, Shilhim, Ain, and Rimmon; in all twenty-nine(29) cities, with their villages" (Josh. 15:21-32 RSV). Thirty-six cities are listed, not 29.
• (d)"...and the sons of Shemaiah; Hattush, and Igeal and Barial, and Neariah, and Shaphat, six" (1Chron. 3:22). Five names don't total six.
• (e) "...the sons od Jeduthun; Gedaliah, and Zeri, and Jeshiah, Hashabiah, and Mattithiah, six, under the hands of their father Jeduthun,..." (1 Chron. 25:3). Again, five names do not total six.
• (f) "And in the lowland, Eshtaol, Zorah, Ashnah, Zanoah, En-gannim, Tappuah, Enam, Jarmuth, Adullam, Socoh, Azekah, Sha-araim, Adithaim, Gederah, Gederothaim: fourteen cities with their villages" (Josh. 15:33-36 RSV). Fifteen cities are listed, not 14.
• (g) "The whole congregation together (those who returned from the Captivity.) was forty and two thousand three hundred and threescore (42,360)" (Ezra 2:64). The number of people in each tribe that returned from the Captivity is listed from Ezra 2:3 to Ezra 2:60. One need only total the figures to see that 29,818 returned, not 42,360- an error of 12,542.
• (h) A similar problem is encountered in Neh. 7:66, which says, "the whole congregation together was forty and two thousand three hundred and three-score (42,360)." One need only add the figures between Neh. 7:8 and Neh. 7:62 to see that the total for all the tribe should have been 31,089, not 42,360-- an error of 11,271. Besides adding inaccurately, Ezra and Nehemiah can't agree on what the total should be. The former supports 29,818 while the latter asserts 31,089.
• (i) "And this is the number of them: Thirty (30) charges of gold, a thousand (1,000) charges of silver, nine and twenty (29) knives, Thirty (30) basins of gold, silver basins of a second sort four hundred and ten (410), and vessels a thousand (1,000). All the vessels of gold and of silver were five thousand and four hundred (5,400)" (Ezra 1:9-11). Even if all these items were composed of silver and gold, they would not total 5,400 (30+ 1,000+ 29 + 30 + 410 + 1,000=2,499 not 5,400).
• (j) "And these were the sons of Levi by their names; Gershon, and Kohath, and Merari" (Num. 3:17) and "Those that were numbered of them (the Gershonites-Ed.)...were seven thousand and five hundred (7,500)" (Num. 3:22) and "...these are the families of the Kohathites...eight thousand and six hundred (8,600)" (Num. 3:27-28) and "...these are the families of the Merari. And those that were numbered of them,...were six thousand and two hundred (6,200)" (Num.3:33-34), versus "All that were numbered of the Levites,...were twenty and two thousand (22,000)" (Num. 3:39). The author of Numbers added inaccurately, since 7,500 + 8,600 + 6,200 equals 22,300, not 22,000.
Besides fallacious counting and adding, biblical authors had difficulty measuring and computing.
• (k) "And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about" (1 Kings 7:23). How could a circle be 10 cubits in diameter and 30 cubits in circumference? Since pi is 3.14, the circumference must be 31.40 (3.14 x 10) cubits.
• (1) "Thirty and two years old (32) was he (Jehoram) when he began to reign, and he reighed in Jersalem eight (8) years, and departed without being desired. Howbeit they buried him in the city of David,... And the inhabitants of Jerusalem made Ahaziah his youngest son king is his stead:... So Ahaziah the son of Jehoram king of Judah reigned. Forty and two years old (42) was Ahaziah when he began to reign..." (2 Chron. 21:20). If Jehoram began to reign at age 32 and ruled 8 years, he died at age 40. Yet his son took over immediately and was 42 years old. The son, Ahaziah, was two years older than his father, Jehoram.
• (m) Ezek. 40:27 is translated as followed in three different versions: "...and he measured from gate to gate the south an hundred (100) cubits" (KJV). "He measured from gate to gate one hundred and seventy-five (175) feet" (Modern Language). "And the distance between the passageway was 175 feet" (Living Bible). If 100 cubits equals 175 feet, then one cubit equals 1 3/4 feet. On the other hand, these versions translate Gen. 6:15 as follows: "...The length of the ark shall be three hundred (300) cubits, the breadth of it fifty (50) cubits, and the height of it thirty (30) cubits" (KJV). "...The length of the ark four hundred and fifty (450) feet; its width seventy-five (75) feet and its depth forty-five (45) feet" (Modern Language). "Make it 450 feet long, 75 feet wide, and 45 feet high" (Living Bible). If 300 cubits equals 450 feet, then 1 cubit equals 1 1/2 feet. The authors of the various versions of the Bible can't agree on the length of a cubit. Is it 1 3/4 or 1 1/2 feet long?
(Source: Biblical Errancy by Dennis McKinsey)
We also have some problem regarding Biblical geography:
(1) "Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born king of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east,...." (Matt. 2:1-2). Since the wise men were east of Jesus, how could an eastern star or a star east of them tell them anything?
(2) "Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a Sabbath day's journey" (Acts 1:12). The inaccuracy of this comment lies in the fact that Olivet, the Mount of Olives was just outside the wall of Jerusalem near the Temple, hardly a day's journey.
(3) "And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim,...." (John 3:23). Nearly all critics agree there is no such place near Salim.
(4) "Then he returned from the region of Tyre, and went through Sidon to the Sea of Galilee, through the region of the Decapolis" (Mark 7:31 RSV). The geographical knowledge of Mark's author is questionable in that it's hard to imagine going from Tyre to the Sea of Galilee by passing through Sidon, much less the region of Decapolis. Sidon is to the north of Tyre and the Sea of Galilee while Decapolis is to the south of Tyre and the Sea of Galilee. This assertion was made by Mark when there were no coasts of Decapolis, nor was the name so much as known before the reign of the emperor Nero.
(5) "Again the devil taketh him up into an exceedingly high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world,...." (Matt. 4:8). How could anyone see the whole world from one spot, even the known world at that time?
(6) "For we have heard how the Lord dried up the water of the Red Sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt" (Josh. 2:10) and "By faith they passed through the Red Sea as by dry land: which the Egyptians as saying to do were drowned" (Heb. 11:29) and "Pharoah's chariots and his host hath he cast into the sea: his chosen captains are also drowned in the Red Sea" (Ex. 15:4) and "But the Egyptians pursued after them, all the horses and chariots of the Pharoah, and his horsemen, and his army, and overtook them encamping by the sea, beside Pi-hahiroth, before Baal-zephon" (Ex. 4:9) and (Ex. 14:22). The Bible repeatedly says the Israelites crossed the Red Sea when they fled Egypt. Yet, they crossed at Baal-sephon which is more than 100 miles north of the Red Sea.
(7) "And it came to pass that when Jesus had finished these sayings, he departed from Galilee, and came into the coasts of Judea beyond the Jordan" (Matt. 19:1). The Jordan River being the eastern boundary of Judea, no "coasts of Judea" existed beyond it. The coast of Judea is the Jordan.
(8) "And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted and became into four heads. The name of the first is Pison: that is it which compasseth the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold;.... And the name of the second river is Gihon: the same is it that compasseth the whole land of Ethiopia and the name of the third river is Hiddehel; that is it which goeth toward the east of Assyria. And the fourth river is Euphrates" (Gen. 2:10-14). The geography of all this makes no sense. There is no Middle East river that divides and becomes the four rivers mentioned.
(a) Havilah is a desert area southwest of Saudi Arabia, residing next to the Red Sea. There is no river encompassing the region. Indeed, one would be hard-pressed to find any river.
(b) The Gihon river is apparently the Nile because it encompasses "the whole land of Ethiopia." Yet, the Nile is nowhere near the alleged location of the Garden of Eden.
(c) This geographical presentation makes the Nile and the Euphrates branch from the same river.
(d) It sounds as if Eden is the entire Middle East since Ethiopia and the Euphrates River are linked together.
(e) What river has ever left the Garden of Eden area and parted into four rivers?
(9) "And they came over unto the other side of the sea, into the country of the Gadarenes (or Gerasenes or Gergesenes)" (Mark 5:1). How could this occur? Gadara and Gerara are both miles from the sea. They do not border it.
(10) "The same came therefore to Philip, which was of Bethsaida of Galilee, and desired him, saying, Sir, we would see Jesus" (John 12:21). Bethsaida is in Gaulonitis, not Galilee.
(11) "And leaving Nazareth (on the western side of the Jordan.), he came and dwelt in Capernaum (also on the western side of the Jordan), which is upon the sea coast in the borders of Zabulon and Nephthalim: That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, by way of the sea, beyond Jordan,...." (Matt. 4:13-15). Zebulon and Nephtali are not beyond the Jordan or across the Jordan. They are on the western side of the Jordan, not the eastern. Moreover, Capernaum is within the borders of Nephalim but not those of Zebulon.
(12) "These things were done in Bethabara beyond Jordan, where John was baptizing" (John 1:28). Contending that Bethabara is an interpolation, the scholar Geihie says, "The most ancient manuscripts read Bethany instead of Bethabara, but no site of that name is now known on the Jordan." The RSV says "Bethany" not "Bethabara." Bethany was a suburb of Jerusalem and was not beyond the Jordan.
(13) "Now when Jesus had heard that John was cast into prison, he departed into Galilee; and leaving Nazareth he came and dwelt in Capernaum,...." (Matt. 4:12-13). If this says Jesus left Nazareth and entered the province of Galilee to arrive in Capernaum, then the geography is poor. Nazareth is as much in Galilee as is Capernaum. If he left Nazareth and went to Capernaum, then he remained in Galilee, since that's the province in which both reside.
(14) "And I answered, `Who art thou, Lord?' And he said unto me, I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom thou persecutest" (Acts 22:8).
(a) "Why would he be called Jesus of Nazareth when he was born in Bethlehem, which is far from Nazareth?
(b) The Jews had every right to reject Jesus as the Messiah since he said he was from Nazareth which is in Galilee. As Scripture says, "Shall Christ come out of Galilee? Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David and out of the town of Bethlehem (which is far south of Galilee), where David was?"
(15) "Every place that the sole of your foot will tread upon I have given to you, as I promised to Moses, From the wilderness and this Lebanon as far as the great river, the river Euphrates...shall be your territory" (Josh. 1:3-4 RSV). Israelite territory has never extended to the Euphrates River.
(Source: Biblical Errancy by Dennis McKinsey)
These are just few examples.
I think it was Thomas Paine who first gave us the first widely-published book about Bible errors in 1796. The book was called “Age of Reason”. In those times it is quite hard to look for books or even a small article regarding Bible errors. Well, the first to explore the issue of Bible errancy were the Roman Catholic. They investigate it for the reason of creating good apologies to defend the Bible. Unfortunately (or fortunately) their studies have broke away from the convents and were commence to theologians, philosophers and ordinary folks.
Today, thanks to the advancement of technology, information and communication, we now have the advantage to do our own examination regarding the Christians claim that the Bible is the inerrant word of God. It’s up to us to examine this using an open mind. If you like to know more Biblical errancy and contradictions, you can visit the following sites: The Skeptical Review, edited By Farrell Till and Biblical Errancy by Dennis McKinsey.
Oh and by the way, maybe you would like to see the following chapter and verses in the Bible:
1. Compare II Chron.36:23 to Ezra 1:2-3
2. In the KJV, compare 2 Kings 19:1-37 to Isaiah 37:1-38. Notice that it is the same word for word. Have they already invented the Xerox® machine in Biblical times?
Weird isn’t it?
John the Atheist
Wednesday, November 14, 2007
Gideon Bible inside hotel room might be a thing of the past.
By Roya Wolverson Newsweek Web Exclusive
The one thing travelers could reliably count on in their hotel rooms: a Bible in the bedside table. But like many traditions, this one may be dying.
In the rooms of Manhattan's trendy Soho Grand Hotel guests can enjoy an eclectic selection of underground music, iPod docking stations, flat-screen TVs and even the living company of a complimentary goldfish. But, alas, the word of God is nowhere to be found. Unlike traditional hotels, the 10-year-old boutique has never put Bibles in its guest rooms, because "society evolves," says hotel spokeswoman Lori DeBlois. Providing Bibles would mean the hotel "would have to take care of every guest's belief."
What might be surprising to many Americans is that the Bible-free room isn't a development just in hip New York City hotels. Across the country upscale accommodations are doing away with the Bible as a standard room amenity. And in its stead have arrived a slew of "lifestyle" products that cater to a younger, hipper (and presumably less religious) clientele. Since 2001 the number of luxury hotels with religious materials in the rooms has dropped by 18 percent, according to the American Hotel and Lodging Association. The Nashville-based Gideons International, which has distributed copies of the Christian scripture to hotels since 1908, declined to comment on this trend.
Edgier chains like the W provide "intimacy kits" with condoms in the minibar, while New York's Mercer Hotel supplies a free condom in each bathroom. Neither has Bibles. Since its recent renovation, the Sofitel L.A. offers a tantalizing lovers' dice game: roll one die for the action to be performed (for example, "kiss," "lick") and the other for the associated body part. The hotel's "mile high" kit, sold in the revamped gift shop, includes a condom, a mini vibrator, a feather tickler and lubricant. The new Indigo hotel in Scottsdale, Ariz., a "branded boutique" launched by InterContinental, also has no Bibles, but it does offer a "One Night Stand" package for guests seeking VIP treatment at local nightclubs and late checkout for the hazy morning after.
The reason for hotels' shift in focus? Leisure travel is up, business travel is down, and younger generations are entering the hotel market. Leisure now leads business by more than 10 percent in U.S. hotel stays, according to travel research firm D. K. Shifflet & Associates. With the lead in technology, design and nightlife, the boutique market is where Generations X, Y and young baby boomers want to be, says CEO Doug Shifflet. And with the boutique sector booming (boutique hotel rooms have grown by 23 percent since 2001, compared to only 7 percent for standard rooms), more traditional chains, which once catered to business clientele, are now desperate to emulate.
Sofitel's brand, for example, is taking "a new direction," says Daniel Entenberg, the "romance concierge" at the chain's flagship Los Angeles location. He was brought in two years ago in an effort to reposition the entire company's image. The chain once had Bibles in all guest rooms, but the corporate office in Dallas recently removed them due to guest inquiries about why other religious texts weren't available.
Even the staid Marriott chain, founded by a Mormon, is debating whether or not to include Bibles in its yet to be named boutique chain, which is set to launch in partnership with hipster hotelier Ian Schrager, who created the '70s disco Studio 54 and later New York City's Morgans, Royalton and Paramount hotels—which are largely credited with kicking off the boutique hotel craze. Schrager says he hasn't yet discussed the Bible amenity with Marriott, though he adds that his properties have never had in-room Bibles.
Marriott spokesman John Wolf says the Bible question is premature for the new venture, which he describes as "cutting-edge," "more urban" and "less values-oriented." Now, there's a marketing slogan no one's tried yet: "Sleep with us. Leave the values at home."
(from Newsweek)
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